“1930 年 9 月标志着德国人不可阻挡地走向第三帝国道路上的转折点。纳粹党在全国选举中取得的令人惊讶的成功，不仅让数百万普通民众，而且让许多商界和军队领导人相信，这或许是一场无法阻挡的热潮。他们可能不喜欢该党的煽动和粗俗，但另一方面，它唤起了德国爱国主义和民族主义的旧情怀，这种情怀在共和国的头十年里一直被压抑。它承诺带领德国人民远离共产主义、社会主义、工会主义和民主的徒劳。最重要的是，它在整个帝国都引起了大火。这是成功的。”
“The month of September 1930 marked a turning point in the road that was leading the Germans inexorably toward the Third Reich. The surprising success of the Nazi Party in the national elections convinced not only millions of ordinary people but many leaders in business and in the Army that perhaps here was an upsurge that could not be stopped. They might not like the party’s demagoguery and its vulgarity, but on the other hand it was arousing the old feelings of German patriotism and nationalism which had been so muted during the first ten years of the Republic. It promised to lead the German people away from communism, socialism, trade-unionism and the futilities of democracy. Above all, it had caught fire throughout the Reich. It was a success.”
《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
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左也行，右也行，文明发帖就欢迎；粉也罢，黑也罢，互相尊重别谩骂。
左也行，右也行，文明发帖就欢迎；粉也罢，黑也罢，互相尊重别谩骂。
#2 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
“... 然而，正如阿道夫·希特勒很快了解到的那样，那些试图推翻它的右翼分子要么被释放，要么被判最轻的刑罚。即使是暗杀者，如果他们是右翼人士，而且受害者是民主党人，也会受到法院的宽大处理，或者像经常发生的那样，帮助军官和右翼极端分子逃离法院的羁押 ... ”
"The failure to clean out the judiciary was another. The administrators of the law became one of the centers of the counterrevolution, perverting justice for reactionary political ends. “It is impossible to escape the conclusion,” the historian Franz L. Neumann declared, “that political justice is the blackest page in the life of the German Republic.”
After the Kapp putsch in 1920 the government charged 705 persons with high treason; only one, the police president of Berlin, received a sentence — five years of “honorary confinement.” When the state of Prussia withdrew his pension the Supreme Court ordered it restored. A German court in December 1926 awarded General von Luettwitz, the military leader of the Kapp putsch, back payment of his pension to cover the period when he was a rebel against the government and also the five years that he was a fugitive from justice in Hungary.
Yet hundreds of German liberals were sentenced to long prison terms on charges of treason because they revealed or denounced in the press or by speech the Army’s constant violations of the Versailles Treaty. The treason laws were ruthlessly applied to the supporters of the Republic; those on the Right who tried to overthrow it, as Adolf Hitler was soon to learn, got off either free or with the lightest of sentences. Even the assassins, if they were of the Right and their victims democrats, were leniently treated by the courts or, as often happened, helped to escape from the custody of the courts by Army officers and right-wing extremists.
And so the mild Socialists, aided by the democrats and the Catholic Centrists, were left to carry on the Republic, which tottered from its birth. They bore the hatred, the abuse and sometimes the bullets of their opponents, who grew in number and in resolve. "
"The failure to clean out the judiciary was another. The administrators of the law became one of the centers of the counterrevolution, perverting justice for reactionary political ends. “It is impossible to escape the conclusion,” the historian Franz L. Neumann declared, “that political justice is the blackest page in the life of the German Republic.”
After the Kapp putsch in 1920 the government charged 705 persons with high treason; only one, the police president of Berlin, received a sentence — five years of “honorary confinement.” When the state of Prussia withdrew his pension the Supreme Court ordered it restored. A German court in December 1926 awarded General von Luettwitz, the military leader of the Kapp putsch, back payment of his pension to cover the period when he was a rebel against the government and also the five years that he was a fugitive from justice in Hungary.
Yet hundreds of German liberals were sentenced to long prison terms on charges of treason because they revealed or denounced in the press or by speech the Army’s constant violations of the Versailles Treaty. The treason laws were ruthlessly applied to the supporters of the Republic; those on the Right who tried to overthrow it, as Adolf Hitler was soon to learn, got off either free or with the lightest of sentences. Even the assassins, if they were of the Right and their victims democrats, were leniently treated by the courts or, as often happened, helped to escape from the custody of the courts by Army officers and right-wing extremists.
And so the mild Socialists, aided by the democrats and the Catholic Centrists, were left to carry on the Republic, which tottered from its birth. They bore the hatred, the abuse and sometimes the bullets of their opponents, who grew in number and in resolve. "
上次由 fieldman 在 2024年 11月 25日 23:41 修改。
#3 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
德国走向共和的历史比中国还短，所以希特勒可以摧毁共和复辟独裁完全不意外。
不看各国历史差异，把美国现在发生的事情和德国历史做一个似是而非的并列，就断定德国发生的就会在美国发生，呵呵， 这种思维实在是太肤浅了。
不看各国历史差异，把美国现在发生的事情和德国历史做一个似是而非的并列，就断定德国发生的就会在美国发生，呵呵， 这种思维实在是太肤浅了。
x2
#6 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
nobody say anything must happen. Yet someone who is so “shallow” to say Trump is Hitler will be the vice president.
jhe123 写了： 2024年 11月 25日 16:01 德国走向共和的历史比中国还短，所以希特勒可以摧毁共和复辟独裁完全不意外。
不看各国历史差异，把美国现在发生的事情和德国历史做一个似是而非的并列，就断定德国发生的就会在美国发生，呵呵， 这种思维实在是太肤浅了。
x1
上次由 fieldman 在 2024年 11月 27日 08:33 修改。
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#7 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
不是因为美国共和历史长，而是川阿扁是个卢瑟，蠢版希特勒，所以屁也干不了。但这货的最大危险是抛猪引狼今后会有更多希特乐王拿逼搅扰生灵。jhe123 写了： 2024年 11月 25日 16:01 德国走向共和的历史比中国还短，所以希特勒可以摧毁共和复辟独裁完全不意外。
不看各国历史差异，把美国现在发生的事情和德国历史做一个似是而非的并列，就断定德国发生的就会在美国发生，呵呵， 这种思维实在是太肤浅了。
#8 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
JD Vance shallow还是阁下您shallow ？！fieldman 写了： 2024年 11月 25日 17:12 nobody say anything must happen. Yet someone who is so shallow will be the vice president.
#9 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
"帕潘相信，在坚定的老总统的帮助下，在他的保守派同事的支持下（他们的人数比顽固的纳粹分子八比三），他将有效地制约纳粹。
但这位轻浮、纵容的政客并不了解希特勒——没有人真正了解希特勒——也不了解希特勒崛起背后的社会力量。除了希特勒之外的任何人，都没有完全认识到，现有的制度和机构——军队、教会、工会、政党——或者广大的非纳粹中产阶级，高度组织化的无产阶级，他们居然都有如此难以解释的弱点。现在这种弱点已经让他们接近瘫痪。正如帕潘后来悲哀地观察到的那样，这些本应是纳粹的制约力量们最终选择了“不战而降”。德国任何阶级、团体或政党都无法逃避自己对民主共和国的放弃和阿道夫·希特勒上台的责任。”
"This unique position, Papen was sure, would enable him to put a brake on the radical Nazi leader. But even more: This government was Papen’s conception, his creation, and he was confident that with the help of the staunch old President, who was his friend, admirer and protector, and with the knowing support of his conservative colleagues, who outnumbered the obstreperous Nazis eight to three, he would dominate it.
But this frivolous, conniving politician did not know Hitler — no one really knew Hitler — nor did he comprehend the strength of the forces which had spewed him up. Nor did Papen, or anyone else except Hitler, quite realize the inexplicable weakness, that now bordered on paralysis, of existing institutions — the Army, the churches, the trade unions, the political parties — or of the vast non-Nazi middle class and the highly organized proletariat all of which, as Papen mournfully observed much later, would “give up without a fight.” No class or group or party in Germany could escape its share of responsibility for the abandonment of the democratic Republic and the advent of Adolf Hitler".
但这位轻浮、纵容的政客并不了解希特勒——没有人真正了解希特勒——也不了解希特勒崛起背后的社会力量。除了希特勒之外的任何人，都没有完全认识到，现有的制度和机构——军队、教会、工会、政党——或者广大的非纳粹中产阶级，高度组织化的无产阶级，他们居然都有如此难以解释的弱点。现在这种弱点已经让他们接近瘫痪。正如帕潘后来悲哀地观察到的那样，这些本应是纳粹的制约力量们最终选择了“不战而降”。德国任何阶级、团体或政党都无法逃避自己对民主共和国的放弃和阿道夫·希特勒上台的责任。”
"This unique position, Papen was sure, would enable him to put a brake on the radical Nazi leader. But even more: This government was Papen’s conception, his creation, and he was confident that with the help of the staunch old President, who was his friend, admirer and protector, and with the knowing support of his conservative colleagues, who outnumbered the obstreperous Nazis eight to three, he would dominate it.
But this frivolous, conniving politician did not know Hitler — no one really knew Hitler — nor did he comprehend the strength of the forces which had spewed him up. Nor did Papen, or anyone else except Hitler, quite realize the inexplicable weakness, that now bordered on paralysis, of existing institutions — the Army, the churches, the trade unions, the political parties — or of the vast non-Nazi middle class and the highly organized proletariat all of which, as Papen mournfully observed much later, would “give up without a fight.” No class or group or party in Germany could escape its share of responsibility for the abandonment of the democratic Republic and the advent of Adolf Hitler".
#10 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
弱智版希特勒闪亮登场VladPutin 写了： 2024年 11月 25日 20:04 不是因为美国共和历史长，而是川阿扁是个卢瑟，蠢版希特勒，所以屁也干不了。但这货的最大危险是抛猪引狼今后会有更多希特乐王拿逼搅扰生灵。
x1
草你特铐谱祖宗十八代加后十八代 你踏马的去死吧
#11 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
loserdom, luck and the grip of mass sentiment could be lethal combination. Hitler had all three, so does Trump.
VladPutin 写了： 2024年 11月 25日 20:04 不是因为美国共和历史长，而是川阿扁是个卢瑟，蠢版希特勒，所以屁也干不了。但这货的最大危险是抛猪引狼今后会有更多希特乐王拿逼搅扰生灵。
#12 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
“......共产党人肆无忌惮、不民主，分裂了工人阶级；大萧条进一步伤害了社会民主党，削弱了工会，并使该党失去了数百万失业者的支持，他们在绝望中要么转向了共产党人，要么是纳粹党。
......社会民主党......现在正值第三个十年的黎明，是一个疲倦的、失败主义的政党，由年长的、善意的但大多是平庸的人主导。
自俾斯麦时代以来，中间党在很大程度上是机会主义者，支持政府对特殊利益集团做出的任何让步……正如我们所见，其领导人正在与纳粹谈判，以授予希特勒总理职位……右翼确信希特勒会留在它的口袋里——他在政府内阁中的人数不是八比三吗？这样的主导地位也本应使保守派（或者说他们认为如此）能够在没有纯粹纳粹主义的野蛮行径的情况下实现自己的目标。 ”
"... the Communists, unscrupulous and undemocratic, had split the working class; the depression had further hurt the Social Democrats, weakening the trade unions and losing the party the support of millions of unemployed, who in their desperation turned either to the Communists or the Nazis.
... the Social Democrats ... now at the dawn of the third decade, were a tired, defeatist party, dominated by old, well-meaning but mostly mediocre men.
The Center Party since Bismarck’s time had been largely opportunist, supporting whatever government made concessions to its special interests ... its leaders, as we have seen, were negotiating with the Nazis to give Hitler the chancellorship ... the Right was sure that Hitler would remain in its pocket — was he not outnumbered eight to three in the Reich cabinet? Such a commanding position also would allow the conservatives, or so they thought, to achieve their ends without the barbarism of unadulterated Nazism. "
......社会民主党......现在正值第三个十年的黎明，是一个疲倦的、失败主义的政党，由年长的、善意的但大多是平庸的人主导。
自俾斯麦时代以来，中间党在很大程度上是机会主义者，支持政府对特殊利益集团做出的任何让步……正如我们所见，其领导人正在与纳粹谈判，以授予希特勒总理职位……右翼确信希特勒会留在它的口袋里——他在政府内阁中的人数不是八比三吗？这样的主导地位也本应使保守派（或者说他们认为如此）能够在没有纯粹纳粹主义的野蛮行径的情况下实现自己的目标。 ”
"... the Communists, unscrupulous and undemocratic, had split the working class; the depression had further hurt the Social Democrats, weakening the trade unions and losing the party the support of millions of unemployed, who in their desperation turned either to the Communists or the Nazis.
... the Social Democrats ... now at the dawn of the third decade, were a tired, defeatist party, dominated by old, well-meaning but mostly mediocre men.
The Center Party since Bismarck’s time had been largely opportunist, supporting whatever government made concessions to its special interests ... its leaders, as we have seen, were negotiating with the Nazis to give Hitler the chancellorship ... the Right was sure that Hitler would remain in its pocket — was he not outnumbered eight to three in the Reich cabinet? Such a commanding position also would allow the conservatives, or so they thought, to achieve their ends without the barbarism of unadulterated Nazism. "
#13 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
fieldman 写了： 2024年 11月 25日 11:47 “... 然而，正如阿道夫·希特勒很快了解到的那样，那些试图推翻它的右翼分子要么被释放，要么被判最轻的刑罚。即使是暗杀者，如果他们是右翼人士，而且受害者是民主党人，也会受到法院的宽大处理，或者像经常发生的那样，帮助军官和右翼极端分子逃离法院的羁押 ... ”
#14 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
......第三帝国并不受益于战争或外国影响。它是由德国人自己在和平时期和平地建立的，既由于他们的弱点，也由于他们的优点。德国人将纳粹暴政强加于自己。他们中的许多人，也许是大多数人，在 1933 年 1 月 30 日中午时分并没有完全意识到这一点，当时兴登堡总统以完全符合宪法的方式将总理职位委托给了阿道夫·希特勒。但他们很快就会知道了。
... The Third Reich owed nothing to the fortunes of war or to foreign influence. It was inaugurated in peacetime, and peacefully, by the Germans themselves, out of both their weaknesses and their strengths. The Germans imposed the Nazi tyranny on themselves. Many of them, perhaps a majority, did not quite realize it at that noon hour of January 30, 1933, when President Hindenburg, acting in a perfectly constitutional manner, entrusted the chancellorship to Adolf Hitler. But they were soon to learn.
... The Third Reich owed nothing to the fortunes of war or to foreign influence. It was inaugurated in peacetime, and peacefully, by the Germans themselves, out of both their weaknesses and their strengths. The Germans imposed the Nazi tyranny on themselves. Many of them, perhaps a majority, did not quite realize it at that noon hour of January 30, 1933, when President Hindenburg, acting in a perfectly constitutional manner, entrusted the chancellorship to Adolf Hitler. But they were soon to learn.
#15 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
经常，在第三帝国的普通家庭或办公室，或者有时在餐馆、啤酒馆、咖啡馆与陌生人随意交谈时，我会遇到看似受过教育、聪明的人说出最离奇的言论。很明显，他们是在鹦鹉学舌地重复他们在广播中听到或在报纸上读到的纳粹怪论。
有时候，即便某一个人想提出不同意见，但在这种情况下，他会遭到如此怀疑的目光，如此震惊的沉默，仿佛他已经在亵渎了全能的上帝，所以他就意识到这样的交流毫无意义，因为对方的思想已经扭曲，对这些人来说，真相和事实就是希特勒和戈培尔所说的那样。
"Often in a German home or office or sometimes in a casual conversation with a stranger in a restaurant, a beer hall, a cafe, I would meet with the most outlandish assertions from seemingly educated and intelligent persons. It was obvious that they were parroting some piece of nonsense they had heard on the radio or read in the newspapers. Sometimes one was tempted to say as much, but on such occasions one was met with such a stare of incredulity, such a shock of silence, as if one had blasphemed the Almighty, that one realized how useless it was even to try to make contact with a mind which had become warped and for whom the facts of life had become what Hitler and Goebbels, with their cynical disregard for truth, said they were"
有时候，即便某一个人想提出不同意见，但在这种情况下，他会遭到如此怀疑的目光，如此震惊的沉默，仿佛他已经在亵渎了全能的上帝，所以他就意识到这样的交流毫无意义，因为对方的思想已经扭曲，对这些人来说，真相和事实就是希特勒和戈培尔所说的那样。
"Often in a German home or office or sometimes in a casual conversation with a stranger in a restaurant, a beer hall, a cafe, I would meet with the most outlandish assertions from seemingly educated and intelligent persons. It was obvious that they were parroting some piece of nonsense they had heard on the radio or read in the newspapers. Sometimes one was tempted to say as much, but on such occasions one was met with such a stare of incredulity, such a shock of silence, as if one had blasphemed the Almighty, that one realized how useless it was even to try to make contact with a mind which had become warped and for whom the facts of life had become what Hitler and Goebbels, with their cynical disregard for truth, said they were"
上次由 fieldman 在 2024年 11月 27日 08:26 修改。
#17 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
当然了，要使整个国家及其所有机构完全置于纳粹的脚下，还有很多工作要做。但是，正如我们将看到的，这也是以令人窒息的速度并在粗暴、诡计和残酷中完成的。... 但是，正如希特勒从未停止吹嘘的那样，议会以压倒性多数投票“合法”地批准了这一决定。德国人不能责怪任何人，只能责怪他们自己。德国最强大的机构一一开始向希特勒投降，并悄然消失并毫无抵抗。
“To be sure, much remained to be done to bring the entire nation and all its institutions completely under the Nazi heel, though, as we shall see, this also was accomplished with breathless speed and with crudeness, trickery and brutality. “The street gangs,” in the words of Alan Bullock, “had seized control of the resources of a great modern State, the gutter had come to power.” But — as Hitler never ceased to boast — “legally,” by an overwhelming vote of Parliament. The Germans had no one to blame but themselves. One by one, Germany’s most powerful institutions now began to surrender to Hitler and to pass quietly, unprotestingly out of existence. The states, which had stubbornly maintained their separate powers throughout German history, were the first to fall”.
“To be sure, much remained to be done to bring the entire nation and all its institutions completely under the Nazi heel, though, as we shall see, this also was accomplished with breathless speed and with crudeness, trickery and brutality. “The street gangs,” in the words of Alan Bullock, “had seized control of the resources of a great modern State, the gutter had come to power.” But — as Hitler never ceased to boast — “legally,” by an overwhelming vote of Parliament. The Germans had no one to blame but themselves. One by one, Germany’s most powerful institutions now began to surrender to Hitler and to pass quietly, unprotestingly out of existence. The states, which had stubbornly maintained their separate powers throughout German history, were the first to fall”.
#19 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
共和历史长，就意味着制度已经稳固建立深入社会文化和民众思想，成了难以轻易被破坏的传统，想改变就很难。VladPutin 写了： 2024年 11月 25日 20:04 不是因为美国共和历史长，而是川阿扁是个卢瑟，蠢版希特勒，所以屁也干不了。但这货的最大危险是抛猪引狼今后会有更多希特乐王拿逼搅扰生灵。
新制度刚推行时总会出现反复，中国有袁世凯和张勋，德国有希特勒，甚至革命最彻底最疯狂的法国，在大革命后不到二十年就有了拿破仑复辟，而美国从开国之日，两百多年，共和制度从来没有遭受过任何值得一提的威胁，即使南北战争国家面临分裂，交战双方的制度依然是共和制。
这个世界上共和制最牢固的国家就是美国，拿其它国家的历史来类比，完全是大谬特谬。
#20 Re: 《第三帝国的兴亡》读书笔记
fieldman 写了： 2024年 11月 25日 17:08 many people are embracing fascism themselves while being confident that fascism won't happen here, becasue they believe other people or the "institutions", or the "establishment" will take on the hard work to stop "it".
jhe123 写了： 2024年 11月 27日 14:01 共和历史长，就意味着制度已经稳固建立深入社会文化和民众思想，成了难以轻易被破坏的传统，想改变就很难。
新制度刚推行时总会出现反复，中国有袁世凯和张勋，德国有希特勒，甚至革命最彻底最疯狂的法国，在大革命后不到二十年就有了拿破仑复辟，而美国从开国之日，两百多年，共和制度从来没有遭受过任何值得一提的威胁，即使南北战争国家面临分裂，交战双方的制度依然是共和制。
这个世界上共和制最牢固的国家就是美国，拿其它国家的历史来类比，完全是大谬特谬。